tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27549167.post734401582508518005..comments2023-09-25T06:48:48.316-06:00Comments on Magic Valley Mormon: Does Eagle Mountain Need UTA?Cameronhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06016275707476655364noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27549167.post-76070916954537346232008-10-29T08:18:00.000-07:002008-10-29T08:18:00.000-07:00As a former city councilman in Santaquin, Utah, I ...As a former city councilman in Santaquin, Utah, I opposed attempts to bring a subsidized UTA mass transit system to Santaquin. It never came, because the city couldn't afford to socialize (yes, <I>that</I> socialism) those costs with increased sales taxes at the expense of the many for the benefit of the few who would ride.<BR/><BR/>Interestingly, I work for BYU, and have been tempted (I still might) to use the much more highly subsidized perk that UTA gives to BYU employees.<BR/><BR/>But from a free market standpoint, I oppose UTA as now constituted (although I still use it from time to time) for the following reasons:<BR/><BR/>1) It needs federal dollars to make it work. Based on average federal inefficiencies, if we had kept the amount of money locally that it took to get $600,000 back from the Feds, we would have had approximately $2 million dollars. That--a state subsidy of $2 million instead of a federal one of $600k--would be much preferable to the current scheme. We've become so enamored by federal largess coming towards us that it's become hard to see the damage that it does when it first leaves our pocketbooks.<BR/><BR/>2) UTA receives a large state government subsidy that crowds out other, potentially more efficient public transit systems. As a result of this subsidy, UTA uses buses that are far larger and consume far more energy than is needed. A private transit system would have to be efficient to succeed, whereas UTA and other public transit systems aren't "burdened" by this "triviality".<BR/><BR/>In some states and locales, it's illegal for private transit to compete with publicly subsidized transit, but I think it's legal in Utah. If there really is enough demand for mass transit from Eagle Mountain (or anywhere), it should be privately implemented. It may be hard to start up in the short run, but in the long run society will be better off for it. <BR/><BR/>For your short run, the best solution is the one you're using--cutting your cost of $160 per month in half by carpooling. Others could cut costs in similar manners, but most people don't look for alternative solutions, because government solutions make sluggards of nearly all of us.Frank Stahelihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01822334061980912687noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27549167.post-5747173626094379802008-10-10T14:57:00.000-06:002008-10-10T14:57:00.000-06:00I want to clarify though. I'm not against mass tr...I want to clarify though. I'm not against mass transit. I think express buses would be valuable to Eagle Mountain. When I went to the U I rode TRAX all the time - largely because of parking issues. (But also because I paid the fare in my student fees whether I used transit or not). My mother-in-law rides an express bus from Riverton to downtown every day, and it serves her well. Downtown workers have very few parking options. If I were in that situation, perhaps my cost analysis would be different.<BR/><BR/>But even with parking, it's hard to come up with the level of money UTA is talking about here. $600k + $10k (at least) + $160/month fare (which are likely to continue to rise). <BR/><BR/>I just don't understand why it costs so much for two express bus routes between EM and Salt Lake.<BR/><BR/>And I wonder if that's the only option.Cameronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06016275707476655364noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27549167.post-78619812305236516812008-10-10T14:49:00.000-06:002008-10-10T14:49:00.000-06:00Jesse,Thanks for the comment.I appreciate the time...Jesse,<BR/><BR/>Thanks for the comment.<BR/><BR/>I appreciate the time argument. However, since the express buses only come at certain times, it's not as though I can use the commute to get work done so I can go home early. Yes, I can work <I>more</I>, and that could be more efficient, but it won't save me any time. In fact, since I carpool I get to drive in the same HOV lane the bus will, so I likely have as short or shorter a commute as bus passengers.Cameronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06016275707476655364noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27549167.post-88024794316727929482008-10-10T11:32:00.000-06:002008-10-10T11:32:00.000-06:00Part of the benefit of the UTA is the reach of the...Part of the benefit of the UTA is the reach of the system and the seamless hand-off from one county to another. That said, public transit needs to present a value proposition to you in order to be worth something. If it ends up being more expensive, it's a waste.<BR/><BR/>When doing that calculation, don't forget the cost of your time. If you can telecommute while on the bus or train, that extra time you travel has just been turned into work time. I have a co-worker who does this on his trip from Clearfield to Sandy each morning and evening and managed to get about two or three hours of work done each day without being in the office at all. You can't very well do this while driving.Jesse Harrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11468928702710912142noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27549167.post-27810597002049351842008-10-09T12:14:00.000-06:002008-10-09T12:14:00.000-06:00jI go to layton to visit my family but after readi...jI go to layton to visit my family but after reading it's 4 bucks a ride, It would be cheaper for me to just drive myself and the kids.Jamiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11710552279975114129noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27549167.post-17159634999261012802008-10-09T09:24:00.000-06:002008-10-09T09:24:00.000-06:00My secrets: fuel efficient car and cruise control....My secrets: fuel efficient car and cruise control. I fill up once a week at around $40 a tank.<BR/><BR/>That's just for the commute to work. $160 isn't my <I>entire</I> gasoline bill for the month. But the express bus would be just for the commute as well.<BR/><BR/>Any ideas on why it costs UTA so much more?Cameronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06016275707476655364noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27549167.post-83310495016548699172008-10-09T09:12:00.000-06:002008-10-09T09:12:00.000-06:00If your costs really are only $160/month you need ...If your costs really are only $160/month you need to share your secret. I have a brother-in-law who told me he was paying over $500/month in gas for his commute of 42 miles - until he quit working where he would have to commute.<BR/><BR/>I'm not trying to doubt your numbers, just to reconcile them to other stories I have heard.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com